What's the difference..?

[Psalm Project]

Oh, re Nick's response... Talk and then walk! (if response is not acceptable)

[Nick Baty]

Yes, PP, I was probably being a tad facetious. But I do wonder why people stick around with priests they can't work with. I certainly wouldn't although, I hasten to add, those with the attitude Dot describes are a tad thin on the ground. Reminds me of the day my time as an Anglican was terminated – as the Rector sacked me, he swore he would "never employ another Roman".

[gwyn]

Dot, I'm with Nick on ths one. Go to another parish where your talents, abilities and commitment will be vauled, appreciated and put to proper use.

That's appauling behaviour on the part of a human bring worse a p.p.

[VML]

What I cannot quite understand about the discussion with your PP, Dot, is how was it that he is organising next Sunday's music. Does your parish, which presumably has some regular musicians, not have someone who puts it all together, and takes responsibility for the music? And if that person as well as all the musicians have to be away at the same time, why has cover not been planned before, unless it is a case of sudden and serious circumstances?
And how come you as a singing leader have not been told/ asked? It could be argued that this is what PP did: told you no-one else is available, but in my own situation, I have a few people I could approach at short notice to hold something together, then I would tell PP what was happening.

Or have they all walked..?

[SOP]

Every parish is different.

I would have been tempted to smile, turn up, play the hymns but also play the Mass parts too as if it was assumed they would be played. Obviously choose a Mass the congregation knows and would sing - not the time to try something new or teach them before Mass started. However, having said something it may be too late.

Anyway, has all this happened now? If so, what actually happened?

[keitha]

I would be a bit cautious here. Dot, you know your PP better than any of us I guess, but I can recall having a blazing row with my PP (not in my present parish) 2 hours before confirmations some years ago. I put it down to our respective states of anxiety and just got on with things. We moved on and have been the best of friends for many years - even though we are now based hundreds of miles apart. Similarly, I have had many bust-ups with a former PP which always seemed to get settled later over a G&T!

My general rule of thumb is that I will put up with rudeness like that once and get on with things, and after that I would be inclined to walk if I could not clear the air and it was repeated. You never know, he may just have been having a bad day.

[Dot]

"AND IT WOULD BE GOOD IF YOU COULD OBEY YOUR PARISH PRIEST!"
That quote is verbatim.
Keith A: I respect all the posts where you've referred to diplomacy as the best course of action.
I like your idea, Sop, of turning up and playing accs as well as hymns. My idea to sing them unaccompanied (eg. plainchant) was to encourage our (rather reluctant) congregation to sing. I hate playing piano solo when it's supposed to be an accompaniment.
I am not going to walk because this man has been rude, he's been rude many times before; nor am I going to return for a round of "reasoning." What really irritated me on this occasion was the ignorance. If someone else wishes to present him with a copy of GIRM, well they'll probably be treated with more respect than I, particularly if they're male.
This PP has two choirs singing within his parish. By and large, he lets them get on with it. The regular Sunday choir is still on summer leave and, in their absence, we've just been having an organist and some hymns.
Quite clearly, this PP doesn't care whether the choirs try to "do it right" or not.
Thanks for the replies - the more the merrier.

dot

[Nick Baty]

My PP approached me today and said, "There are no musicians around next Sunday morning; could you play the hymns?"

This is the bit I don't quite understand. Surely you and your PP will have known several weeks ago what it to be sung next week.

The regular Sunday choir is still on summer leave

If I'm honest, I'm not sure about this either as the most important bits are sung by the assembly.

[Peter]

This is the bit I don't quite understand. Surely you and your PP will have known several weeks ago what it to be sung next week?

Not necessarily: different parishes work in different ways. Like Nick, I like to plan the hymns for my church well in advance, but the PP doesn't see them before I send the Mass sheet to the parish office for printing, which is normally during the week preceding the Mass in case my selections need to be tweaked in he light of changed circumstances (eg if certain musicians suddenly become (un)available or if references to collections or other topical events need to be added). If I know that there will be no musicians I simply include music that will work unaccompanied, but the sheet will still get sent to the parish office as usual.

At another church where I sometimes used to play it was the organist who chose the hymns, so if I was deputising for the regular organist I chose them - in advance wherever I could but sometimes it was at very short notice. If there was no-one able to play, someone else would pick four hymns out of those suggested in the Decani Liturgy Planner.

In neither of these cases would the PP expect to know a week in advance who was playing, let alone what they were playing. In any case, he had many other things to worry about. Thus the situation Dot describes would not have happened in either place - but if it had, both PPs concerned would have handled it in a more tactful way than hers!

[Dot]

Today was the "Sunday with no musicians" (see above) and I duly played the hymns for a congregation, whose response was measurable in the presence of the Children's Liturgy group and almost imperciptible in their absence (there are several strong singers involved in children's liturgy). We sang the Gospel Acclamation unaccompanied and I began the Communion song (Berthier - In the Lord - as used at Salford Cathedral today, I note!) without accompaniment, building up the accompaniment verse by verse, then diminishing again to unaccompanied. As the congregational singing was so thin, I didn't venture to play Gathering Accs, as I might have done had there been more people there. The only thing that would have worked today would have been a plainsong setting, and I couldn't stand up and challenge the PP to allow me to start it after what he said last week.
After Mass, the people who acknowledged the music mentioned only the singing, not the playing - that's what was important to them. I hope I shall be brave enough to mention this if I'm ever asked to "play the hymns" again.

Dot

[musicus]

Well done, Dot. And thanks for reporting back.

[VML]

Dot, that's the way to do it!
Thanks for telling us how it went.

[SOP]

Well done Dot. I am impressed you got any feedback - must have made an impression.