Notation software

[alan29]

Yes it worked well ..... but it does come up with some interesting chords ..... G#?

[Nick Baty]

Depends if you're going up or down!

[High Peak]

Just going through some old threads.....

After a hopeful search on t'internet about eight months ago I came across MuseScore. I have been very impressed with how powerful this piece of free software is. I use it mostly for when I set a Psalm response to music and when I want to provide a harmony line for our flutes. (Several of our group also get together for the Parish St. Patrick's function and I use MuseScore to provide music to old favourites such as Whiskey in the Jar, again for our flautists.)

I really appreciate how it plays back my compositions (a lofty term for my modest achievements) so I can hear whether I have got it right - my ability to read music is REALLY limited.

MuseScore is clearly able to deal with far more complex tasks than I can throw at it and I can heartily recommend it.

[contrabordun]

Yes, I like it too, and it can turn midi files to score (less widely available than sibelius, etc, but quite a lot of cpdl scores have them). What is vastly annoying about it for the sort of stuff that I have to set is that there's no free rhythm setting: every bar has to have a defined time signature. This is a bit of a pain in the proverbial for chants of any kind.

[JW]

Yes, I like it too, and it can turn midi files to score (less widely available than sibelius, etc, but quite a lot of cpdl scores have them). What is vastly annoying about it for the sort of stuff that I have to set is that there's no free rhythm setting: every bar has to have a defined time signature. This is a bit of a pain in the proverbial for chants of any kind.

Glad I'm not the only one who has counted the number of beats in a piece and set up a time signature of something like 111/8! And then there's the issue of hiding all the note stems if you want dots instead of proper notes! It seems a bit inflexible too when you add lyrics, especially if you want 4 verses between a stave and you want them in larger print! As a free resource though, I think MuseScore Is very good.

[High Peak]

Yes, I like it too, and it can turn midi files to score (less widely available than sibelius, etc, but quite a lot of cpdl scores have them). What is vastly annoying about it for the sort of stuff that I have to set is that there's no free rhythm setting: every bar has to have a defined time signature. This is a bit of a pain in the proverbial for chants of any kind.

Glad I'm not the only one who has counted the number of beats in a piece and set up a time signature of something like 111/8! And then there's the issue of hiding all the note stems if you want dots instead of proper notes! It seems a bit inflexible too when you add lyrics, especially if you want 4 verses between a stave and you want them in larger print! As a free resource though, I think MuseScore Is very good.

I have been frustrated by all these limitations, and had a good chuckle as your posts reminded me of the same dead-ends. But, as you say, as a piece of free software it is very good.

[quaeritor]

I've just revisited this thread (and re-read the whole of it! - do I qualify for a gold star?) because I'm thinking (again!, but seriously this time) of moving away from Windows - fed up of continually having to re-learn stuff for what are in effect new operating systems, or new Office systems and thinking it's time I returned to my core skills and took to Linux - but most of the time I'm actually sitting in front of a screen is taken up with score setting. (Or laboriously typing posts such as this!)

I've been using Personal Composer for what feels like forever - a quick check tells me I've got some scores still on disc dating from 1970 - and it does actually do everything I try - eventually! - including some of the particular challenges identified earlier in this thread. Want to fit a long set of words under a reciting note? - just drag the bar line at the end of the bar as far to the right as you need. Want to vary the number of beats in a particular bar? - just specify the number of 32nds, (8 = a crotchet) in an invisible override, without changing the time signature as such. You can even opt for the bar to just extend as you add notes, but that's rather new and I've not made it work more conveniently than counting up in advance, setting the length of the bar, and then entering the notes. There are many other useful features for "liturgical" use - different note head shapes, hiding stems etc.

On the downside it has always tended to be fragile - defensive work, saving frequently, pays dividends, and it has an upsetting tendency to revert to a standard layout when you have made what seems to be a simple change to a previously carefully amended page layout, and even today after all these years it will occasionally get tied into a knot, but it was always less expensive than the big packages - at the moment a restricted version limited to eight staves in a system (enough for most parish needs, I think) is promoted at a list price of US$70.

However, it is only available on PC, so it's time to consider the different options.

Has the situation moved on since the demise of Sibelius reported earlier in this thread?

Any advice would be welcome.

Q

[Nick Baty]

We've just received Sibelius 7.5 in work – came out earlier this year, I believe, but have yet to explore it.
I buy most of my software from http://www.studica.com
They offer academic and church discounts.
Also worth searching the programme you need on Google shopping, adding "academic pricing".

[quaeritor]

So reports of Sibelius's demise were exaggerated then? - is the Sibelius/Finale debate still running?

BTW, after my post above I noticed that the current website for Personal Composer states it was introduced in 1983, so I can offer no explanation for the file date I quoted (especially as I didn't buy my first pc until 1986!! Doh!)

Q

[musicus]

So reports of Sibelius's demise were exaggerated then? - is the Sibelius/Finale debate still running?

Yes, they were.

Both programs are capable of producing very fine results. I suggest that you download the free 30-day trial versions and draw your own conclusions.

I would urge you to avoid the "lite" cut-down versions, though. I have recently been helping a friend to typeset her new Mass setting; she only had Sibelius 6 First, so we wasted a lot of time passing files back and forth between our computers, since a fair bit of it had to be done on my machine, which has the full Sibelius 7 installed, containing a fair number of features which are missing in the "lite" version of the program. The same would apply to Finale.

Oh, and other notation programs are available...

[VML]

Just to throw the cat among the pigeons: I have been persuaded to try easy abc, and it is great if I just need to transpose a psalm response quickly.
It is far more versatile than I could have believed, and free.

[John Ainslie]

The great thing about Capella - and I have used it for the whole of my English Proper Chants (melody and accompaniment editions) - is that you can dispense with bar lines as a regular feature altogether, and just insert them where you want them. Invaluable for chant and free-rhythm composing.

Only available for Windows, though. At £167 rather more affordable than Sibelius at £399 (current Amazon prices for full editions).

[Southern Comfort]

The great thing about Capella - and I have used it for the whole of my English Proper Chants (melody and accompaniment editions) - is that you can dispense with bar lines as a regular feature altogether, and just insert them where you want them. Invaluable for chant and free-rhythm composing.

Only available for Windows, though. At £167 rather more affordable than Sibelius at £399 (current Amazon prices for full editions).

That sounds very interesting. Can you say a bit more about what you actually do when entering music, and also whether this means the programme doesn't work "in a time signature" at all?

Further back in this thread you mentioned that it only exports to XML format. Is that still correct in the latest version?

[John Ainslie]

The great thing about Capella - and I have used it for the whole of my English Proper Chants (melody and accompaniment editions) - is that you can dispense with bar lines as a regular feature altogether, and just insert them where you want them. Invaluable for chant and free-rhythm composing.

Only available for Windows, though. At £167 rather more affordable than Sibelius at £399 (current Amazon prices for full editions).

That sounds very interesting. Can you say a bit more about what you actually do when entering music, and also whether this means the programme doesn't work "in a time signature" at all?

Further back in this thread you mentioned that it only exports to XML format. Is that still correct in the latest version?

Here attached below is a screen shot of a main entry screen. You'll see that, having selected a template, I am being asked to specify clef (if I needed to change it), key and time signature. If I click 'No Time Signature' then no bars at all will appear until I want one. Then I click the bar symbol on one of the toolbars above and get a choice of single or double bars, repeat bars, etc.

Capella can export in MusicXML. I believe that there is a special plug-in for exporting to Sibelius. I'll send a sample if you are interested.

[High Peak]

FYI, Musescore has recently been updated from version 1.3 to version 2.0

There are some very good improvements but also the way some things are done has changed, and will cause a little confusion at first.

Musescore 2.0 can read 1.3 files, but not vice versa.

When you "update" it actually downloads a second programme, leaving version 1.3 intact should you wish to revert to using it.