The Glory Days

[NorthernTenor]

Whisky and bed.

[dmu3tem]

Could I go back to the second message on the thread, which focussed on the need to involve young musicians?

First, it is true that a number of prominent young church musicians do seem to be keen on reviving a traditional diet of plainchant and Renaissance Polyphony mainly sung by choirs and therefore to some extent at the expense of congregational participation. Whether this is true of a majority of young church musicians I simply do not know; but I am inclined to doubt this, especially among the rank and file cheerful amateurs who help out at parish level. These are the sort of people we are primarily dealing with on a week by week basis in parish churches. Someone like the Grade VI standard violinist or the Grade 3 standard Cornet player who first joined up in our parish at the ages of 13 and 11 respectively. In both cases they came partly because their parents suggested it, partly because (or in spite of) of what the sounds they heard in the choir loft, partly because it was a fun opportunity to use their musical skills instead of just hacking away at a number of set pieces and scales in boring music lessons. They stayed because I kept writing and arranging music specially for them.

Now, are these types of people likely to be concerned with the ins and outs of what Vatican highups have said at various times in certain key liturgical-musical documents? Whenever I read them a kind of 'glazed' effect comes over my mind, even though I know that these may well be harbingers of the future direction church music might take and therefore should be studied. The 'glazed' effect is enhanced by the ecclesiastical terms of phrase and vocabulary that are habitually used (the church equivalent of computerese). Surely throwing this sort of stuff at these musicians is likely to be a real turn-off?

If this is the real situation then the issues are these:

(1) How do you persuade young musicians to use and develop their talents in church services? What incentives and opportunities do we offer them?

(2) Once they become enthusiastic, it is at that stage they might start thinking about the underlying thinking about what sort of music you have. Indeed I would say they pick it up almost by osmosis from what they hear and do. So, in the case of my violinist and cornet player they get the idea that instruments can be used flexibly (and I hope creatively) in church both as backing/descants for hymns, psalms, gospel acclamations, mass settings etc, and in as soloists replacing the organ voluntary slots. If they like that sort of thing, they will then, willy-nilly, start to string together such preferences into an underelying philosophy which they will adjust (or back) by cherry picking appropriate passages from church music literature. I know (because I have met them) this was how some young devotees of plainchant and renaissance polyphony got their particular ideas. They heard the stuff - probably well performed live or on CDs - they liked it, and this meshed with their developing sense of religious awareness.

So, if one wishes to steer a generation of young church musicians in a certain stylistic direction, it seems to me that you do it in this 'back to front' sort of way. If you think a certain sort of musical approach should predominate, you 'educate' not by showing them 'boring' church documents but by showing them a pattern of musical practice.

This sounds a bit wishy-washy; but I do hope that readers get my basic drift.

[Nick Baty]

I think Thomas is 100 per cent spot on!

[johnquinn39]

So, if one wishes to steer a generation of young church musicians in a certain stylistic direction, it seems to me that you do it in this 'back to front' sort of way. If you think a certain sort of musical approach should predominate, you 'educate' not by showing them 'boring' church documents but by showing them a pattern of musical practice.

This sounds a bit wishy-washy; but I do hope that readers get my basic drift.

My feeling on this is that the texts (psalms acclamations) are the starting point. If we educate young musicians about what
is actually intended to be sung (whether this is congregational, dialogical, or choral), then they might 'find their way into' the prayer of the Church.

I am not sure about steering them in the direction of a particular style. We now have a huge variety of musical styles available to us, so why not let them find something that can work (for all of us) as prayer?

I personally found my way into the Psalms as prayer, by being asked to supply music for the Resposorial Psalm.

Looking at the documents (GIRM; Music in Divine Worship; MS etc.), it seems that all styles are permitted, and there is plenty of provision for 'choir only' spots (my preference would be maybe to sing a choral version of the Psalm of the day at the gifts).

Perhaps this another thread, but why not 'mix 'n' match' styles. Jazz and Rock, for example have revived the old modes.
Could we look at using more percussion and World music styles in our liturgy? How about singing some Arvo Part?
Not forgetting Reggae and Folk. (And Gregorian Chant!)

[NorthernTenor]

Thomas,

That's spot on - at Spode Music week we always have a significant number of young musicians who don't spend their time on the theory, but just enjoy doing it - where 'it' is singing plainsong, polyphony and new music, plus all the programmed and ad-hoc non-liturgical music-making that goes on. In fact, one of the key things that gets people coming back year after year (often until they bring children themselves) is that there's no artificial dividing line between liturgical and non-liturgical music making.

That, of course, begs the question of the underlying liturgical assumptions that underpin such happy activity, and the direction one may wish to steer people in, which was the other point of the thread. At some point it's right to reflect on what we do and why. I guess those assumptions are less spoken of at Spode because it's a music week for Catholics, rather than a liturgy summer school (SoSG) or sacred music colloquium (CMAA). it does sometimes become explicit in lectures, but they're just as likely to be about music therapy or the late Beethoven quartets as they are the Propers.