PANEL decisions

[Nick Baty]

And how long does it take for an item to really become the song of the people.
Now, if I could ever write something like this I could die happy!:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qu_rItLP ... re=related

[HallamPhil]

Was that Marty on the guitar vocals?

[NorthernTenor]

Hallam's first bishop banned one setting of the Mass Ordinaries but 15 years after his death and despite the efforts of the Diocesan Director of Music it (and its like) still persists in some parishes. None of us, not even bishops, has the unquestioned authority that existed in the past, and some bishops might not wish to use it even if it existed. People no longer readily obey what is categorically stated/instructed and i do not regret this. In this we are all as vulnerable and powerless as Christ. What was it they said about horses and water? It doesn't matter. What does matter is that alternatives are offered and that these are consistent with current Church expectations. In this we attempt to show our loyalty. What was it that Christ said about having to drink from a certain cup?

Indeed, HP. Though, more positively, perhaps things will improve if the Bishops institute active formation of the clergy in these matters; not just seminarians (who, anecdote tells, us are more likely to understand the issues), but also those whose training and experience reflects the many years in which the importance of singing the black wasn't widely understood.

[mcb]

And how long does it take for an item to really become the song of the people.
Now, if I could ever write something like this I could die happy!:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qu_rItLP ... re=related

Or why not just write another tune that will fit? The four-blade razor can always use a fifth.

[presbyter]

mcb - delete text of the magic dragon and, with tiny adjustments, insert new Sanctus text - then submit to panel!

[presbyter]

mcb - up there in sunny Salford, do you still sing the Coronation Street tune to the present Sanctus text?

[Nick Baty]

Or why not just write another tune that will fit?

I'd forgotten about that one!
But now I seem to remember this being your idea!

[mcb]

mcb - up there in sunny Salford, do you still sing the Coronation Street tune to the present Sanctus text?

Did we? The nearest we get these days is the occasional outing for the Gathering Mass Holy Holy, the middle eight of which has always struck me as uncannily similar.

[mcb]

mcb - delete text of the magic dragon and, with tiny adjustments, insert new Sanctus text - then submit to panel!

It fits scarily well! You have to squeeze "Heaven and earth are full of your glory. Hosanna in the highest" into the second line of the music, but even there the words and music go together as well as, oh, the ICEL chants...

[NorthernTenor]

I find discussion of the ICEL chants to be interesting in a number of ways, and not just for the subject itself. I wonder how much of the work submitted to the Panel will be same old, same old, of the kind that doesn't just fail to encourage solemnity but actually militates against it, through ethos, incompetence or both; and how much of the criticism of the ICEL chant comes from those responsible for producing and programming it?

It's no coincidence that, when the Ordinariat clergy and candidates were asked at Alan Hall about any particular difficulties they'd met, the first answer, to great mirth, was "the music".

[Calum Cille]

I wonder how much of the work submitted to the Panel will be same old, same old, of the kind that doesn't just fail to encourage solemnity but actually militates against it, through ethos, incompetence or both; and how much of the criticism of the ICEL chant comes from those responsible for producing and programming it?

(Right, no more criticism of the ICEL chants from me, folks. Time to cover tracks: I mustn't give Northern Tenor the impression that I, amongst others, am an enemy of Gregorian chant and the solemnity it represents. From what he writes, his keen doubts over the genuineness of my points about the relationship between English text and Latin chant gives him cause to wonder about a possible causative connection between my criticism and the nature of my compositional output. I would say that I would stop submitting work to the Panel but, sadly, I don't submit work to the Panel - freedom! Back to my irreverent Gaelic hymn now which has caused me to assail the ICEL chants with such self-betraying vitriol ...)

[Nick Baty]

one must submit five copies of the published piece to the Liturgy Office

Do they pay for them? Let's say five copies of a possible collection that might retail at £14.95..... that's £74.75p. That's quite a "freebie" they are asking for, don't you think?

Does anyone happen to know why the Panel needs five copies while ICEL needs only one?

[musicus]

So they can have one each?

[presbyter]

I wonder how much of the work submitted to the Panel will be same old, same old, of the kind………

"In preparation" (according to Boosey & Hawkes website), James MacMillan, Mass of Blessed John Henry Newman ..... available already from GIA, Liam Lawton, The Glendalough Mass..
For the former - see and listen to the Papal Visit videos from Glasgow and Cofton park. For the latter, sample here:

http://www.giamusic.com/search_details.cfm?title_id=11349

Of the two settings, I think NT and I will be in agreement about which one we might prefer.

The BCEW panel and the US Bishops' panel cannot suppress diversity of style, let alone make assessments based on panel members' personal tastes. Yet they can ensure the music serves the new texts.

I shall be sad, though, if new settings contribute further to liturgical fragmentation in the Church - even within a parish - and the faithful pick and choose the celebrations they attend on grounds of musical style. Perhaps that's inevitable?

[Nick Baty]

I shall be sad, though,... and the faithful pick and choose the celebrations they attend on grounds of musical style. Perhaps that's inevitable?

Although, hopefully, it will be the other way round and the musicians will select style to suit the assembly. I don't think this sort of diversity is a problem as long as there are settings which the whole parish can sing when they come together for the great festivals. In fact, up here we'd see this sort of choice as bordering on affluence – we have to find music common to the three-and-a-half parishes who share a priest.