Alternative texts for Mass.

[FrGareth]

his Sunday, I have been informed, something called the 'live simply creed' will replace the Nicene Creed at Mass for Peace Sunday. The intention is to have something 'meaningful in the context of that particular Mass.' ...I have suggested that we are not really at liberty to substitute the words of the Creed, except in particular circumstances, when the Apostles' Creed or Renewal of Baptismal Vows is used.

If I were minded to use such a text, I would employ it (legitimately!) as a sermon illustration, given that a "dialogue sermon" is permitted, rather than substituting any required part of the Mass.
FrG

[docmattc]

VML, I hope you have pointed out paragraph 69 from Redemptionis Sacramentum:

In Holy Mass as well as in other celebrations of the Sacred Liturgy, no Creed or Profession of Faith is to be introduced which is not found in the duly approved liturgical books.

[VML]

That's what I said to our PP last time, (or the time before.) I was reminded of that by Googling said 'live simply creed', and it came up with my posted gripe on this forum!

[nazard]

...Is there really a will to tie the Mass down to a rigid unchangeable ritual in the Tridentine style? ...

More to the point, would it be a good idea?

[docmattc]

...Is there really a will to tie the Mass down to a rigid unchangeable ritual in the Tridentine style? ...

More to the point, would it be a good idea?

I've always advocated formation over legislation but having had Mass this morning with:
no Psalm or 2nd Reading
sitting for the Gospel
applauding the prospective 1st communion children for moving on to module 2 of their colouring in course
PP's personal version of the doxology
priest's private prayers before communion said aloud and changed to include whole congregation
final blessing as "May Almighty God bless us..."

I'm not so sure it would be a bad idea.

[presbyter]

......... but having had Mass this morning with..........

that's not "Alternative texts for Mass" - it's an Alternative Mass!

[musicus]

applauding the prospective 1st communion children for moving on to module 2 of their colouring in course

Harsh!

[Southern Comfort]

The rest is certainly an Alternative Mass, but

final blessing as "May Almighty God bless us..."

is inclusive language, particularly in the Solemn Blessings which otherwise come across as unbearably patronising and presumptuous.

[nazard]

Many people would consider "May Almighty God bless you" to be inclusive. I thought that the point was that when a priest is present, he prays for God to bless the people he is shepherding, but when there is no priest we all pray together for God to bless us. You can see a rubric to this effect at the end of each office. Of course, neither is particularly inclusive: they both have limits in normal understanding. Perhaps the priest meant to say "bless everyone and everything, past present and to come..."

[Southern Comfort]

Here are a few random extracts from the Solemn Blessings of the Roman Missal:

You believe that the Son of God once came to us;
you look for him to come again....

You rejoice that our Redeemer came to live with us as man....

You believe that by his dying Christ destroyed death for ever....

You have mourned for Christ's sufferings;
now you celebrate the joy of his resurrection....

You received the author of life through Mary....

You have come to rejoice at Mary's feast....

Admittedly not all the texts are as patronising as that, but the cumulative effect of the above, over a period of time, is unpleasant. It rather strongly implies to the listener that the priest does not consider himself to be part of the assembly, for a start. Simply changing all those yous to We makes a considerable difference to the way it all comes across. And if you are going to do that, when why not say, in conclusion, "May almighty God bless us..." ?

Indeed, there is actually a precedent for this in the Solemn Blessing for the Dead, where the second invocation runs

To us who are alive
may he grant forgiveness....

where it could easily have said "you" instead of "us".

[Nick Baty]

To us who are alive
may he grant forgiveness....

where it could easily have said "you" instead of "us".

Suggesting all our priests are dead!!

[Southern Comfort]

Suggesting all our priests are dead!!

[docmattc]

And if you are going to do that, when why not say, in conclusion, "May almighty God bless us..." ?

Because it isn't the text printed in the Missal, and no priest may on his own initiative (or even that of SC) change the text.

I'm with nazard on this, the priest is able bless us by virtue of his clerical state. Here he is blessing the people, which is why he is making the sign of the cross over the people and not on himself. Changing the text might be intended as inclusive, but actually shows a wooly understanding of the theology of priesthood.

[Nick Baty]

[Southern Comfort]

Because it isn't the text printed in the Missal, and no priest may on his own initiative (or even that of SC) change the text.

Of course there are many occasions on which one may change the text. It isn't all black and white.

Here he is blessing the people, which is why he is making the sign of the cross over the people and not on himself. Changing the text might be intended as inclusive, but actually shows a wooly understanding of the theology of priesthood.

Beware of imputing woolly theology! The priest is not blessing the people. He is invoking God's blessing on the people (and one hopes on himself too), but theologically only God can bless, not us, whether clerical of lay. That's why a priest says "May almighty God bless you" and not "I bless you". Ministers of Communion "give a blessing", parents bless their children, we say "[May God] bless you!" when someone sneezes. But in all these cases we are not blessing anyone. We are asking God to bless them.

In this context, it is certainly permissible to think about how we build community through the liturgy by examining the language we use.