Youth

[presbyter]

And then - what is it that is so attractive to many of our youth who are becoming involved in the Youth 2000 prayer groups? Their style is far removed from that of the London theatre. One might almost say that it is "traditional Catholic" and devotional - a form of worship that many of us middle aged oldies put aside in the 1970s .

[Alan]

True, which is why it is unwise to make any assumptions about style (and why I did not mention it in my last post).

[dunstan]

The point I keep stressing is that sitting here criticising the evangelical approach (however justifiably) won't persuade anyone to walk into our churches rather than evangelical ones. We need to ask "What would?"

Well, I would hope the opportunity of an ongoing and deepening relationship with Christ.

We come right back to the key mission of SSG (that's us, folks): helping to create a nourishing liturgical experience. Easy to write, very difficult to achieve, as it depends on so many skills, principly vested in the celebrant but also in those who hold other ministries (from the musicians to the greeters). We are obsessing about a group who, pro tempore, seem to have "cracked it". They haven't of course, they've found a way for the present of attracting large numbers, possibly because, within a specific group of people, they are rather fashionable. If what they're achieving is being described as a "phenomenon" then it is probably not particularly durable.

Our mission is different to theirs. Is there much which we can pick up from them - possibly. Should we be trying to emulate them - definitely not.

What aspects of their achievements should we be seeking to recognise and emulate?

[presbyter]

We need to ask "What would?"

Faith and love of God - in response to God's love for us. Faith that has "clicked" and become personal.

Faith is caught not taught? I didn't go to a Catholic secondary school but my faith "clicked" around age 14 I think.

[MaryR]

Faith is caught not taught? I didn't go to a Catholic secondary school but my faith "clicked" around age 14 I think.

Ah, well mine didn't 'click' until I was in my early thirties. But up until then I'd been active in my parish - reading and singing in the choir - since my teens so I was in the right place to catch it, I suppose.

As for distinguishing between those who drift away and engage in no active public worship, those who drift off to other churches and those who have never had any contact in the first place, I've seen quite a few drift off to other churches from our parish, but more just drift away from any form of worship. I'd say the theatre is predominantly made up from groups two and three. Probably with the group twos encouraging their group three friends to give it a try. The group ones are the least likely to give it a try.

So far as the Catholic Church is concerned, I think we need to concentrate on hanging on to groups one and two because, in doing that successfully, we ought to attract the group threes.

(I hope all that makes sense )

Alan, many thanks for your suggestions which I'll take along to tomorrow's meeting with me.

[presbyter]

If what they're achieving is being described as a "phenomenon" then it is probably not particularly durable.

St Augustine would certainly agree with you there and as Mgr Knox's magisterial survey reveals, "Enthusiasm" in the history of Christianity has always led to heresy, fragmentation and damage - both to the Church and to individuals personally.

Hillsong has an avowed intent to form a world-wide, biblically based united church. It won't achieve it. Protestantism has always had an inbuilt tendency towards fission. There will be arguments and fallings out - factions will arise. Those who do not study history are doomed to repeat it.

[presbyter]

It is essential that sacred music should be, well, sacred, and to embrace the mundane because it appeals at a superficial level is a slippery slope down which I don't want to go.

I'm not alone in this view.

The then Cardinal Ratzinger's article is, of course, extremely erudite and well argued. But he does not address sufficiently, in my opinion, the conciliar insight of what makes music sacred, which is not necessarily stylistic. There is a Magisterial definition of what makes music holy: its intrinsic connection rite.

How many adults - let alone youth - in our pews have any understanding of, for example, the ritual shape and the ritual actions of the celebration of the Eucharist and what God is doing for us in the ritual action? Read paragraph 11 of Sacrosanctum Concilium - has that formation ever taken place in your parish? Would it help sustain and strengthen the faith of youth and adults if it did?

[docmattc]

How many adults - let alone youth - in our pews have any understanding of, for example, the ritual shape and the ritual actions of the celebration of the Eucharist and what God is doing for us in the ritual action? Read paragraph 11 of Sacrosanctum Concilium - has that formation ever taken place in your parish? Would it help sustain and strengthen the faith of youth and adults if it did?

I'm doing a few sessions with our Journey in Faith group about the symbolism of the Mass. Last night it came as news to everyone (catechumens and Catholics of 60 years) that the reason the introductory rites were conducted from the chair was something other than there happened to be a microphone there. The group also found challenging my suggestion that the ambo should only be used for proclamation of the Word, not appeals, announcements etc.
Formation of the laity is sadly lacking, and given some practices mentioned on these pages, formation of the clergy isn't that great either.