Malurgy

[Nick Baty]

Yes, I did miss out the problems with lighting and English as a second language – thank you for those.
I think, Bob, we'd best agree to differ.
I'll carry on being inclusive and you carry on being exclusive.
And one day we'll meet in the afterlife and all this won't matter.

[BobHayes]

I'll carry on being inclusive and you carry on being exclusive.

Ouch! A tad judgemental and a whiff of pride. God bless.

[Nick Baty]

Not at all.
Just do what you do and we'll do what we do.
Don't have the energy to battle.
Spend my working week battling for inclusivity in further education – and, trust me, that's one helluva battle.
Don't usually have to argue for it on Sunday as I work in an inclusive parish.
God bless you too.

[BobHayes]

Ah the joys of working in FE. My chosen trade as well. Take care!

[Nick Baty]

And you.

[alan29]

I find it difficult to understand the need to isolate the eucharist from the rest of the life of the parish which leads into and flows from that celebration.........Body of Christ, and all that. Anyone remember talk about "authentic" liturgy, which was not the same thing at all as "valid" liturgy.

[BobHayes]

I find it difficult to understand the need to isolate the eucharist from the rest of the life of the parish which leads into and flows from that celebration.........Body of Christ, and all that. Anyone remember talk about "authentic" liturgy, which was not the same thing at all as "valid" liturgy.

The Eucharist is 'the source and summit of Christian faith' according to our Catholic Faith, Tradition and teaching. Worshippers anticipating a presentation (say on parish reorganisation) will inevitably be distracted from the essence of the Mass. In this Year of Faith the Holy Father is asking us all to deepen our understanding of the Faith, to think about what the Creed says and means and what we believe. Have we perhaps come to see Mass merely as a gathering of like-minded people and a vehicle for communication of pastoral matters? I don't know....

[helen rees]

As someone who grew up with "this is The Gospel of the Lord" " PRaise to you Lord Jesus Christ" "the summer fete will be held on Saturday..... The senior citizens meet on Tuesday......"
I am quite pleased it is after the communion prayer before the final prayers. The mass on Sunday is the whole parish coming together and i feel it is only right that the priest speaks to us or for that matter invites someone else in to talk to us about important issues or charities

When it comes to the subject of Malurgy though, I am more concerned about practices introduced into our parish recently -
Exposition running for the hour before mass, saying a decade of the rosary before the final prayer, the decommissioning of eucharistic minisiters to be replaced by a priest coming out of the presbytery not having been in the mass to distribute communion, and the introducition of visiting priests to hear confession during mass

I am sure that all of these things are valid if my priest is introducing them but they do seem contrary to all my limited understanding and leave me questioning what I have beleived about the mass - I expect altar rails soon. Oh and to make matters worse Bob - the parish notices are given before the prayer after the communion and the homily is started with a sign of the cross.

It has led me to pray more though

[BobHayes]

It has led me to pray more though

That is always welcome!

[Peter]

An SVP appeal is a worthy cause; so too are appeals for Aid to the Church in Need, Caritas, fundraising for the local hospice, fundraising to send young parishioners to WYD Rio, fundraising for the roof and so on. No matter how worthy the cause, a presentation disrupts the spiritual encounter that is Holy Mass. What is more the General Instruction (n.90 and n.166) permits only 'brief announcements', so presentations should not be taking place.

I don't think anyone on this thread has been avocating PowerPoint presentations at this point in the Mass, and I can't see anything wrong in a "brief announcement" about appeals on the lines Bob quotes, or as we had recently, about a food bank we're asked to contribute to. These are all examples of making the transition from hearing the Word of God at Mass to responding to it in a practical way in our lives outside Mass.

However, Bob would have been horrified by a recent Confirmation Mass I attended: between the Postcommunion Prayer and final blessing and dismissal, we had group photos in front of the altar for the confirmands from the various parishes in the pastoral area. (Un?)fortunately, the musicians had not been issued with parts for "Flash, bang, wallop, what a picture!" to accompany it but even if they had, it might not have been heard above the conversation in the congregation.

[alan29]

"Conversations in the congregation."
I wonder about nuptial masses when only one side is catholic. At a recent one here the grooms side seemed to be of no faith. The wedding was at a time that allowed for plenty of pre-celebratory libations (sorry about that, my English seems to be getting ICEL'd up) which the grooms friends seemed to have enjoyed to the full. Our PP is excellent at providing a commentary, but one half of the gathering seemed intent on chattering their way through the quiet bits.
Are there times when the nature of the congregation should dictate what kind of celebration there should be?
I have played at plenty of requiems where the priest the server and I seem to have been the only catholics present, to the confusion of the mourners.
Are these examples of avoidable malurgy?

[johnquinn39]

I have been asked to put on hymns to Our Lady during May and October.

I will accompany these items if people want them. (The parish priest is
very flexible about what we sing).

However, I have no doubt that I will be asked to accompany 'As I kneel before you' at communion.

The idea of installing altar rails has also been mentioned.

As my job title is 'parish helper', I am not going to argue with any of this.

But I do see the above as examples of Malurgy.

[Nick Baty]

I'm afraid I would refuse – but the situation wouldn't arise as my PP wouldn't allow this anyway.

[gwyn]

The idea of installing altar rails has also been mentioned.

Deo gratias.

[musicus]

I have been asked to put on hymns to Our Lady during May and October.

I will accompany these items if people want them. (The parish priest is
very flexible about what we sing).

However, I have no doubt that I will be asked to accompany 'As I kneel before you' at communion.

The idea of installing altar rails has also been mentioned.

As my job title is 'parish helper', I am not going to argue with any of this.

But I do see the above as examples of Malurgy.

I admire your loyalty and patience, John. I'm not at all sure I could emulate it.
I did put my foot down on one occasion with regard to devotional hymns at Mass, and things did become a little fraught for a minute or two, until both parties realised there was more to lose than to be gained. These days, I suppose I would be more willing to play ball.

And yes, this is all 'malurgy'.