Better and Worse Aspects of the Reform

[nazard]

I found it very useful for presbyter to raise the subject of the singing in certain masses in the extraordinary form: it allowed me to compare the state of affairs in the ordinary form. I certainly think it appropriate at this juncture to discuss specific reforms (whether applied, not applied or exceeded) and the meaning and worth of them in your own part of the world at least, with participants raising the various advantages and disadvantages of them.

I thought it better to start a new thread for this reply.

To get us started I have divided the topics up into four headings: Good, Not worth the bother, Bad and Silly. Here I go then:

Good.

The liturgy of the word, including the use of lay readers
The tidying up between the priest's communion and the people's
The reduction in the amount of genuflecting and signs of the cross the priest does during the eucharistic prayer
Having the chalice waiting on the credenza
Not walking up to the altar, going back to the bottom of the step and praying to be made worthy to approach it, and then going back
Moving announcements from between the gospel and the sermon to before the dismissal
Putting the dismissal after the blessing

Not worth the bother

The bidding prayers

Bad

The loss of the prayers at the foot of the altar, although they would have been better moved to after the credo
The loss of the prayer asking for absolution
The prayer over the gifts
The alternative eucharistic prayers, particularly No 2
The memorial acclamation
Priests not keeping their thumb and forefinger pressed together from the consecration to the ablution except when handling a host
The loss of a time for a short recollection after reaching the communion rail, and before leaving it
The loss of the last gospel
Celebration versus populum

Silly

Moving the Sequence (that which follows) to before the Alleluia

A few things I am undecided about. Perhaps board members would like to categorise:

Saying the eucharistic prayer audibly
Getting rid of the maniple and biretta
Priests not crossing their stoles over their chests - this still goes on but is not universal now

[Calum Cille]

Celebration versus populum

'Versus populum' isn't the big issue for me, it's 'ad orientem', and 'ad orientem' need not be a simple matter of the priest facing in the same direction as the people and thus facing away from the people, eastwards. Despite that, how rich the implications of these words by the Holy Father are.

"Where priest and people together face the same way, what we have is a cosmic orientation and also an interpretation of the Eucharist in terms of resurrection and trinitarian theology. Hence it is also an interpretation in terms of parousia, a theology of hope, in which every Mass is an approach to the return of Christ."

"We are celebrating with the cosmos, with the world. It’s the direction of the future of the world, of our history represented in the sun and in the cosmical realities."

One interesting practice was not reintroduced in the reforms for churches which have the door to the east: that moment which is still announced by the Deacon in Coptic liturgy after the kiss of peace and before the sanctus. It never fails to send, as it were, a shiver down my spine (perhaps this is the Gael in me). "You who are seated, stand. ... Look towards the east."

At the high point of the mass, in churches where the door was to the east (in Rome, for example), the people would turn from facing the altar and priest to face the east with the priest, thus physically uniting in bodily orientation with the priest. Horror - not looking at the priest!?!?! Not even his back!?!?!

[Eastern Promise]

Yes, but hmmm. I'm with many of the posters here who think the present Pope is a bit out of touch, I'm afraid.

[Calum Cille]

Then archbishop Angelo Bagnasco: "What the Pope encourages us to adopt, beyond the cultural forces to which one is necessarily susceptible, is thus an inclusive, and not a confrontational, interpretative key." Yes, I can see how that would be out of touch with many on this forum

[Eastern Promise]

I was at a Mass this morning where the Praise Band sang a theologically astute version of "We Are Beautiful" by Christina Aguillera. It was fantastic! The words were all changed of course to be more liturgically appropriate, but the refrain was the same. We all joined in, of course. It was so uplifting we spontaneously burst into applause. It was at the Offertory.

After Mass, the band were rehearsing for a baptism and they were running through "Isn't she lovely?" by Stevie Wonder with amended text by Michael Joncas or somebody. It was so moving. It was a baby girl they were christening. I recognised some of the liturgical musicians. I had seen them at Cofton Park doing the pre Mass entertainment with those nice Anglican bishops, swaying and smiling. I caught a few words with them and told them that they should have been doing the music for the Beatification Mass, so that the outside world could have seen the true nature of our modern liturgy. They were very appreciative - "Next time!" How we laughed.

[HallamPhil]

I do hope you have not inadvertently landed CJM in a legal case regarding presumably unauthorised adaptation of material owned by Aguilera or her publishers.

[Eastern Promise]

What or who us CJM?

Are these particular praise songs work in Sheffield too?

[keitha]

CJM Music arranged and led the "pre-Mass entertainment" (aka 'Morning Prayer') that was held with "those nice anglican bishops".

[presbyter]

I do hope you have not inadvertently landed CJM in a legal case regarding presumably unauthorised adaptation of material owned by Aguilera or her publishers.

Being unfamiliar with the work of the aforesaid Aguilera, I have Youtubed the official video.

1. The song itself is remarkably similarly in idiom to Lennon/McCartney hits of some decades ago and maybe Aguilera herself could be charged with unauthorised adaptation of that material - or maybe pastiche is just the highest form of flattery.

2. Aguilera sounds peculiarly asthmatic in places and I would also recommend a medical examination to see if there are any unwanted nodules developing on her vocal chords.

3. I don't believe a word of EP's post.

[musicus]

Are these particular praise songs work in Sheffield too?

Içi on parle ICEL 2010 (aka Yoda).

[Eastern Promise]

Thanks Keitha. I've just visited the CJM website. It was them I met yesterday! I agree with their blurb - they are "consummate performers." I see that they have some new mass settings of the new translation in the pipeline too. That'll put the wind up the traddies, eh? I bet they thought that this new translation was going to stop all the theologically astute, Haugenesque new Catholic music. No chance. It's business as usual. Yippeeee!

[HallamPhil]

I'm not at all clear what EP is writing about. I think he/she should note that the texts of the new translation are fixed and their theological content is therefore also fixed and will remain so whoever may be the composer of a setting. The 'yippee' comment reveals that EP's enthusiasm is reserved more for ill-conceived controversy than considered observation.

[alan29]

Good
The clear distinction between the word and sacrament
The emphasis on the word
The less sacrificial nature of the "offertory" prayers
The demise of much terrible and unworthy music and dreadful renderings of same
Vernacular
Eucharist = giving thanks
Lay ministers
Less bobbing and weaving and "wiggling elbow syndrome" (if you are old enough, you will recognise it.
Opening the scriptures
The opportunity given for young instrumentalists to make an important and valued contribution where it really matters

Bad
Carte blanche sometimes taken when not on offer
The dismally unchristian attitudes adopted by some critics.
A reluctance to expect certain standards of behaviour/dress when at Mass
The loss of worship outside Mass

[Eastern Promise]

Alan29

"Good" - hear, hear. I couldn't have put it better myself, especially the bit about instrumentalists, otherwise we wouldn't have CJM - the future of the liturgy.

"Bad" - oh I don't know. I could live with most of this.

[alan29]

Alan29

"Good" - hear, hear. I couldn't have put it better myself, especially the bit about instrumentalists, otherwise we wouldn't have CJM - the future of the liturgy.

"Bad" - oh I don't know. I could live with most of this.