Am I being a pedantic bore ? (yes)

[johnquinn39]

Choir and organ have been requested for a weekday Mass which will be celebrated by a visiting bishop who likes music.

Needless to say, choir & organist have not been consulted about the choice of music.

Needless to say, the music has been chosen by someone who knows nothing about the liturgy.

Needless to say, the psalm and acclamations are forbidden.

Needless to say, two of the hymns chosen are, in my view, banal and misleading.

Groan / bore / winge etc. etc.

[docmattc]

needless to say, choir and organist have said they are not available?

[johnquinn39]

needless to say, choir and organist have said they are not available?

Yes, we are available, and this Mass will be taking place during our usual rehearsal time!

[gwyn]

I'd be inclined to be unavailable unless certain conditions as defined by Holy Mother Church are adhered to.
We have a ministerial function, not that of a doormat.

[festivaltrumpet]

visiting bishop who likes music...

... the music has been chosen by someone who knows nothing about the liturgy.

Could one surmise that these are one and the same person?

I concur with Gwyn and Docmattc, unless you can have some say, you are unavailable.

[Nick Baty]

Mass which will be celebrated by a visiting bishop who likes music...the psalm and acclamations are forbidden.

But surely, you will explain to the one responsible, as there is a bishop present you have no choice but to sing the psalm and acclamations. After all, the bishop belongs to that group which produced Singing the Mass, (http://www.liturgyoffice.org.uk/Resourc ... nging.html) and you wouldn't want anyone to get into trouble with his Lordship for disobeying their Lordships' instructions.

I should point out that anyone is welcome to come any make any sort of music at the liturgy in our parish. But if they take the song away from the people or alter the order of musical priorities, pacifist as I am, I'd punch their *beep* lights out!

[Mithras]

Choir and organ have been requested for a weekday Mass which will be celebrated by a visiting bishop who likes music.

Needless to say, choir & organist have not been consulted about the choice of music.

Needless to say, the music has been chosen by someone who knows nothing about the liturgy.

Needless to say, the psalm and acclamations are forbidden.

Needless to say, two of the hymns chosen are, in my view, banal and misleading.

Groan / bore / winge etc. etc.

So

a) what were the two hymns?

(b) what eventually happened?

M

[musicus]

Yes, do tell.

[johnquinn39]

Yes, do tell.

OK.

We were allowed to sing the psalm - Gelineau's 'The Lord is my shepherd'.

We were allowed to sing the Alleluia - The 'paschal' alleluia (versicle chanted to a Murray tone).

The Sanctus / Memorial / Amen / Agnus Dei were recited.

'In bread we bring you Lord' was sung at the gifts.

The choir changed the words of the communion song from 'here in bread and wine for me' to 'here in flesh and blood for me'.

[Nick Baty]

We were allowed to sing the psalm...The Sanctus/Memorial/Amen/Agnus Dei were recited.

Sometimes it makes you wonder why we bother.
I suppose I'm fortunate in that in my last three parishes I've worked with PPs who've made it clear to visitors that "this is how we do it" and it's never been a problem.
But the more I read on here, the more I despair when I hear of musicians' hard work being overruled by those who – in all humility - don't appear to know what they're doing.

[docmattc]

But the more I read on here, the more I despair when I hear of musicians' hard work being overruled by those who – in all humility - don't appear to know what they're doing.

We've bemoaned this before.

...the vast majority still have a 'low Mass with hymns' mentality. In spite of the good examples we set, a four hymn sandwich is the default position for many, all those 'other bits' are optional extras.

Does the "many" really include bishops?

[Nick Baty]

Does the "many" really include bishops?

Yes, I'm afraid it does, judging by what happens in some of their cathedrals. (Immediately stressing that there are some cathedrals where they really do things superbly: Clifton, Hallam, Salford etc.) But we've been here so very often before. Sigh!

In the last 30 years our bishops have produced, among other things, (2005) Celebrating the Mass: A Pastoral Introduction, (2002) The Order of Mass: A Guide for Composers, (1999) A Preliminary Syllabus for the Formation of Church Musicians, (1982) Music in the Parish Mass, (1969) Music in the Mass.

How long before we see the fruits of all documents?

I have a dream that one day, probably long after I'm dead, some young priest or liturgical musician somewhere will start leafing through the words of Barr, Crichton, Gelineau, Howell, Huijbers, Inwood, Tamblyn, Winstone et al. And they'll have a flash of inspiration and realise, "These guys really had a point".

We are asked to sing so little in our liturgy: four acclamations and one, possibly two, psalms. The message couldn't be simpler. Why have so many people (including a couple of bishops) not heard it?

Am I turning into a Grumpy Old Git?

[dmu3tem]

My own recent experience in my last parish might be instructive.

In effect we had a four hymn sandwich, a full Mass Ordinary, a responsorial psalm (or communion antiphon) and a gospel acclamation, to say nothing of the requirement to have two organ voluntaries (one at communion, the other at the end) or an instrumental equivalent. This meant that on a typical sunday we (that is the choir, congregation and instrumentalists) worked through 12-13 pieces. On any given Sunday the presence of a different communion antiphon, responsorial psalm and gospel acclamation text meant that the choir (and congregation) were faced with at least 3 new pieces. We certainly coped - and would have done more than that if we had had more musicians available. Indeed, I viewed it as part of a strategy to raise the sight reading and general musical skills of the choir and instrumentalists and hopefully get new recruits. However, there was little doubt that the pressure - especially on me - was quite heavy. In many ways this was a good thing, as this helped hone my skills, especially in arranging and composing music that was practical. However, I can see that this sort of workload might prove daunting for some, especially if -as is usually the case - they have other jobs (to say nothing of family commitments) to do.

You might then say, why did we not scrap the four hymn sandwich? The answer was simple. This was the base from which we were building. When I arrived hymns were the one thing the congregation had had any real experience of singing. Often they were the most familiar tunes known to them. So we had to use the hymns and 'bolt on' the other items. Note too that one is also driven in this direction by the fact that you have new texts for the Psalm, Gospel Acclamation, Entrance and Communion Antiphons every week; so with these the congregation is perpetually faced with the need to pick up new music. Elsewhere, there are threads which advocate the use of a 'common core' of texts; but in practice this was wholly unrealistic with my parish because it used a weekly 'Missellette'. The congregation therefore expected to use the texts provided there. To a lesser extent, the same situation arises if you expect congregations to rely on their missals. You can only use a 'common core' if every week you issue your own 'missellette', or at least a sheet/booklet with the relevant common core texts in it. Alternatively, you produce a 'common core' booklet for all occasions with every item numbered in it as in a hymnal.

[Southern Comfort]

The choir changed the words of the communion song from 'here in bread and wine for me' to 'here in flesh and blood for me'.

They should, of course, have changed them to "for us". That is a major problem with this evangelical-character song: it talks about "us" in the first half of the refrain and then switches (still in the same sentence) to "me", presumably for rhyming purposes (certainly not for theological purposes), before continuing with a very personalistic "me" for verse 1 (yes, I know vv. 2 and 3 are better in this respect).

On those grounds alone this song should be banned from our communion repertoire ─ and cf. GIRM 86: "...the Communion chant is begun. Its purpose is to express the communicants' union in spirit ... and to highlight more clearly the 'communitarian' nature of the procession to receive Communion."

[Nick Baty]

this was wholly unrealistic with my parish because it used a weekly 'Missellette'.

Easily solved – pile up the Missalettes, add liberal amount of lighter fuel, add match and stand back.